#www.undernet.org

here you can make posts that do not belong in other forums

What do you think about #www.undernet.org

It`s a great idea. I love it.
17
40%
It`s a good idea.
10
24%
It`s not such a good idea.
1
2%
I`ve seen better.
5
12%
It`s not a good idea.
1
2%
It`s useless. Close the channel.
8
19%
 
Total votes: 42
User avatar
sirAndrew
Posts: 760
Location: Romania

#www.undernet.org

Post by sirAndrew »

As you all know, our website now has an official channel on irc where users can apply for online help about the website and the forum.

The project is new and we opened this topic in order to hear your complaints/suggestions regarding the ideea. What do you think we should add or do to provide you a better service.

We are open for any sugestion and i assure you all of them will be taken seriously into consideration. However that does not mean they will be applied for sure. We are also opened to all your complaints.

So, visit us on irc in #www.undernet.org and talk about any idea you think will help us, then post them here.

Regards,
Undernet Webmasters/Forum Admins/Moderators
Last edited by sirAndrew on Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
sirAndrew @ Undernet.org

8 years on this forum and i'm still the #1 poster around.

User avatar
Hekim
Posts: 18
Location: Antalya

Post by Hekim »

i think this is a beatiful idea. so users can join the forums too much..
Respectfully
Hekimoglu®

Spidel
Posts: 639
Location: Backyard

Post by Spidel »

Well the point of my view is.. the following, it`s a wise ideea, never thought a help channel regarding undernet forums will be open.. however i'm pleased to see this.. when i'll have some issues regarding undernet forums, i'll ask in there i'm sure i'll got a reply from the volunteers from there.. in a short period of time :) i guess that`s the prupose of #www.undernet.org and that`s why it was opened, for being helped online and to get a answer quickly
Keep up the great work in here. and in there.

Regards,
Spidel
"A wise man writes down what he thinks, a stupid man forgets what he thinks, a complete idiot punishes himself for what he thinks."

User avatar
Getodacul
Posts: 185
Location: Dacia, Sarmisegetuza

Post by Getodacul »

Useless. Another official channel for what? Try to make all the channels: #cservice.undernet.org #user-com.undernet.org #coder-com.undernet.org #routing-com.undernet.org etc.
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Drive defensively; buy a tank.

User avatar
GeStaPo
Posts: 16
Location: Europe

Post by GeStaPo »

Its Good Idea, #Cservice is for X commands and registered channels, #Usernames is for Users, #Help is for help with mirc ;
So #www.undernet.org will be for all things about Undernet, all questions there, about X , forum, unregistered channels.... i think that is good idea for HELP channel


Greetings from Pyriel ( DeadSpirit )
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Wolfyx
Posts: 323
Location: Nowhere

Post by Wolfyx »

You obviously didn't understand anything of what sirandrew said
I'm an angel, honest! The horns are just there to keep the halo straight

evol
Posts: 15
Location: Cyprus

Post by evol »

At first i thought it was a good idea and it worthed to try it. However, after being on the channel for two days, i am not too sure about it. Its mostly idle users.

Maybe it will be improved in the near future; i don't know.

Anyhow, i will just wish you good luck :bandit:
[img]http://www.danasoft.com/sig/evolish.jpg[/img]

puterfixer
Posts: 212

Post by puterfixer »

Here's the deal: a service is normally created in response to observing a problem or a need which needs to be resolved. This is the logical order: first we become aware that there's a need, a problem, then we find a solution for it. When people found out their cars needed to be cleaned quickly and easily, car washes were created. When people thought they would benefit from talking on the phone with others from their cars, on the train or while walking on the sidewalk, mobile phones were invented. Right? It's not the other way around. People don't create rules for how cars should properly take off from a public road until cars actually start flying. People will not start making and selling concentrated food for dinosaur pets, when there are no pet dinosaurs. A company making winter gloves will not start selling gloves with 10 fingers when there are no people with 10 fingers on one hand. An inventor will not create a square wheel and hope that someone might somehow find it useful one day. See my point? First comes the problem, then the solution.

For some reason, this logical cause-effect relationship has always been backwards on Undernet, and it's really turning into a tradition. For instance, some people love to create rules, and they are so creative about it that they create rules for situations that have not yet been encountered, not even once. IRC is a consequence of the need to chat. Each channel is a solution for the need to chat on a specific topic. When the need arises, the channel is opened. It's elementary that the same reasoning should apply to #www.undernet.org . Are there really so many people looking for help about the Undernet website and forums, that the help provided through the forum is simply insufficient and opening a live chat channel is required? Are there so many people talking in that channel 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, to justify its registration? How many people have joined that channel asking for help, what is the average number of questions per hour? Do these statistics confirm or infirm the need for this channel to exist?

I am sorry to say that these initiatives are really short-sighted and have absolutely no point, no reason to be implemented, no real need to address and solve. It really is a custom of creating solutions for inexistent problems and to implement ideas that have no perspectives. At this time, #www.undernet.org has no real reason to exist. There is no demand from users and too little activity to justify its existence. This initiative might have seemed cool at first, but nobody seemed to take the thought further than the first two steps, to try to answer questions like: Why does this channel exist? What is it trying to accomplish, how well is it solving a problem, what are its perspectives for the future? As I see it, the idea is a dead end now, and someone needs to have the courage to admit that at this time the channel is not needed, the idea has been a failure, and the channel will be closed until a real need for its existence emerges. It really is no shame to admit when a project doesn't work out; failures are normal in real life, it's a sign of maturity to acknowledge them and clean up after them.

All the best,

- puterfixer

PS - Note to some people, they know who they are: If you plan to reply, you'd better have read this post in its entirety and closely. I'm not going to repeat myself just because you don't feel like reading more that the first 3 words in each paragraph. If you want me to read what you have to say, you should read what I have said too.
The first step in improving something is acknowledging its problems. This is my contribution to a better CService: http://www.cservice-sucks.net/

User avatar
xplora
Posts: 564
Location: Hamilton, New Zealand

Post by xplora »

GeStaPo wrote:Its Good Idea, #Cservice is for X commands and registered channels, #Usernames is for Users, #Help is for help with mirc ;
So #www.undernet.org will be for all things about Undernet, all questions there, about X , forum, unregistered channels.... i think that is good idea for HELP channel


Gestapo, Wolfyx is correct you didn't understand it...

#help is for generic help, anything/everything
#mirc is for help with mIRC
#usernames if for help with getting and using a username, not "users" as that just means everyone and doesn't really say what they help with
#www.undernet.org is for help with http://www.undernet.org/ and http://forum.undernet.org/, not X, not unregistered channels, just those 2 websites

Irku
Posts: 206
Location: bucharest

Post by Irku »

:devil:

puterfixer wrote:I am sorry to say that these initiatives are really short-sighted and have absolutely no point, no reason to be implemented, no real need to address and solve. It really is a custom of creating solutions for inexistent problems and to implement ideas that have no perspectives. At this time, #www.undernet.org has no real reason to exist. There is no demand from users and too little activity to justify its existence. This initiative might have seemed cool at first, but nobody seemed to take the thought further than the first two steps, to try to answer questions like: Why does this channel exist? What is it trying to accomplish, how well is it solving a problem, what are its perspectives for the future? As I see it, the idea is a dead end now, and someone needs to have the courage to admit that at this time the channel is not needed, the idea has been a failure, and the channel will be closed until a real need for its existence emerges. It really is no shame to admit when a project doesn't work out; failures are normal in real life, it's a sign of maturity to acknowledge them and clean up after them.

I was about to post something similar to that, but shorter, when I noticed his post. And one more thing... This channel is the result of someones wish of.. dunno.. getting official, getting important, getting noticed for the idea, having lots of known nicknames below his ass.

User avatar
Mitko
Posts: 594
Location: Europe

Post by Mitko »

Irku, puterfixer said something totally different from your opinion. Your last (and seems like second) sentence in your post is nothing else but offending official people. I said this because I see that you really care about being official or not, so, why would someone want to be official if (s)he already is ? Think about that. But, if offending is the only way you can show that this channel is a bad idea instead of saying some arguments, then I can't do nothing about that. And, I am really wondering who is the person behind that "his" from "having lots of known nicknames below his ass" since this channel is created by the Undernet User Committee Webmasters Project.

The channel is to provide support for the Undernet Website and Forums. The fact that we have helped people makes the channel still existent. In the channel you said "a website with a forum are ment for support. Support for support sounds like a bad idea". Well, we have helped a few users to register and activate their users as well. As you know, not registered people can't post in the forums (they can just read).

As long as there is activity in the channel, even if it's not much, the channel should exist. Oh, and it's good to have all Undernet Website and Forums people (webmasters, moderators, etc) in one channel because it's easier to contact one that way instead of looking for him/her with /who, /whois or joining other channels. This way, the team is a little bit more organised too.

Well, this is my personal opinion. My arguments are far away from offending you or someone else, Irku. The forum is a place where the users give opinions (as puterfixer did), where the users are discussing, and not a place to show your anger. Try to keep the flame in yourself since this is a wrong place to show it off and it's against the Forum AUP.

Best Regards,
Mit.
Dimitar Tnokovski aka Mitko
[img]http://rap.com.mk/images/UL/mitko_userbar.gif[/img]

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Mitko
Posts: 594
Location: Europe

Post by Mitko »

Getodacul wrote:Useless. Another official channel for what? Try to make all the channels: #cservice.undernet.org #user-com.undernet.org #coder-com.undernet.org #routing-com.undernet.org etc.

It's not needed since they already exist, just without that .undernet.org so I don't see the point in your post Getodacul.


Best Regards,
Mit.
Dimitar Tnokovski aka Mitko
[img]http://rap.com.mk/images/UL/mitko_userbar.gif[/img]

User avatar
Genie
Posts: 3
Location: Lebanon

Post by Genie »

As Senior xplora says every official channel arround undernet netwrok have its own work and its own rules in helping users , trainee volunteer's ... etc

#help & #mirchelp , for general and for all kinds of help realated for undernet .

#vh & #Dmsetup , For virus/trojan/malware related questions

#Usernames , for are problems related for the Usernames of the Undernet users

#Cservice , for general questions relate about X commands

and the defference betwen the official channels and #www.undernet.org that this channels for gining more infrotmations about undernet services
network and remember for UNDERNET site that make the users check all the new's there and give us his opinion arround undernet so that is a good job and its a knowledge for the othere to join this like take and give informations for the othere post here the interrest's talking about new things make a new realations "Frienship's" have fun , so there NO and any problem for viewing thats channels especialy thats it's builded from a nice goup maybe a family like cynthia and Eenie . simba etc , i with the best for them and for all the undernet coders/admins/opers/helpers/trainee/users , 10x
i could began but i cant end (Knowledge is a Power)

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sirAndrew
Posts: 760
Location: Romania

Post by sirAndrew »

I didn`t want to reply to this thread as i opened it...but it seems i have too.

You have to understand the purpose of the channel. Take into consideration that the website represents the web part of the network which is ment to be an irc network. So the website if the web corespondent of the network and the channel is the irc corespondent of the website.

For the more, if you get an error or you have trouble on the website...you`ll ask for help on the forum, which will take a few days untill a decent reply will appear that will trully satisfy you. Or to give an example: if you forum username is inactive, how the hell do you get it reactivated?! Emailing the admin?!...finding the admin`s email adress and than waiting for a reply will only make users mad and make them give up using the website and the forum.

A friendly irc channel, with a reply rate of a few hours tops is better than waiting a few days for something that it can take minutes to get solved.

So i`m very sorry speedy but #www.undernet.org was not ment as a solution to any problem, but an improvement of the services we offer.

It`s still a small project you have to give it time to grow in popularity and eficiency...i didn`t expect too see an over-populated channel where everyone comes all day and night to ask for help. Not yet at least. I don`t know why experienced users do not give credit to an ideea....it might not be the brightest ideea man kind has ever seen but it`s still an ideea and you need to give it time.

Regards,
sirAndrew
sirAndrew @ Undernet.org

8 years on this forum and i'm still the #1 poster around.

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Stefanoo
Posts: 127
Location: Beirut

Post by Stefanoo »

its a good idea. at least we can find the webmaster
Stefano @ Douaihy.org